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bush vs clark
rcmodels
Ranger
in Zocalo v2.0
for awhile now, i've been noticing several similarities between bush and the fictitional president clark.
this just adds to it: [url="http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=1086&ncid=716&e=2&u=/ap/20020721/ap_on_go_pr_wh/homeland_security_6"]http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=1086&ncid=716&e=2&u=/ap/20020721/ap_on_go_pr_wh/homeland_security_6[/url]
this just adds to it: [url="http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=1086&ncid=716&e=2&u=/ap/20020721/ap_on_go_pr_wh/homeland_security_6"]http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story2&cid=1086&ncid=716&e=2&u=/ap/20020721/ap_on_go_pr_wh/homeland_security_6[/url]
Comments
[This message has been edited by Warleader D'Ren (edited 07-22-2002).]
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[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
[b]Oh geez. You guys are in the shit, with a president as dumb as that. And you have a flawed election system to thank for it.
[/b][/quote]
You singing the true words brother!
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[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
Say your going to do everything that anybody could possibly want
Rule 2 of american politics
Do nothing.
Everything that has been proposed so far is still hanging in congress, and god knows how long it will be there with the party squabling going on.
Secondly america's electoral system reflects a certain reality, we are a FEDERAL republic, not a pure democracy, If the high population states (especialy california and New York) called the shots all the time, there is a good chance the rest of the nation would split. There are definate sectional/regional issues, and thats why are senate is apportioned by state and our electoral system is horribly confusing.
On the bright side, it means if bush keeps this up he wont keep it for another 4, no matter how popular he seems to be at the moment.
at least he's not building orbital weapons platforms (yet)
[This message has been edited by Tyvar (edited 07-22-2002).]
Think about the terrible options facing the administration. I applaud them for taking the lesser of several evils. There is no good choice and it's easy for you to computer chair opinionate.
But I know, odds are you're thinking I'm just some Ignorant American, Right?
All of you who are making these comments are burning bridges, it gets more tiresome every day.
This is just one more Anti American/Bush Flame. The first post had no real quality dialoge or commentary. I say we close this.
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[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
[b]Frankly I would much rather have the United States Military [/b](who have a code of ethics and conduct)[b]
[/b][/quote]
The fact that Bush made the Haag Warcriminal Court (dont remember its exact name now) back down from prosecuting US peacekeepers in the Balkans proves this is not so.
interesting links: [url="http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/07/12/us.international.court/index.html"]http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/07/12/us.international.court/index.html[/url] [url="http://www.hrw.org/press/2002/02/geneva0207.htm"]http://www.hrw.org/press/2002/02/geneva0207.htm[/url] [url="http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/02/07/ret.bush.detainees/"]http://www.cnn.com/2002/US/02/07/ret.bush.detainees/[/url]
[You'll have to copy and paste this one - mod] [url="http://208.37.97.178/scripts/cqcgi.exe/@pdqtest1.env?CQ_SESSION_KEY="]http://208.37.97.178/scripts/cqcgi.exe/@pdqtest1.env?CQ_SESSION_KEY=[/url]
UFPXLTAHQNZD&CQ_QUERY_HANDLE=124024&CQ_CUR_DOCUMENT=1&CQ_PDQ_DOCUMENT_VIEW=
1&CQSUBMIT=View&CQRETURN=&CQPAGE =1
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Passive fields. January two thousand and twelve. A nation that stands alone. Cold voices, faces pale, Gathered unto their judgement day. Such words remain unspoken. Such pride remains unbroken. Just mothers to stand in vain and cry. Tears and medals in the rain. Shall I recall when justice did prevail? No reason to be found why reason did fail. The all clear resounding. The way was clear to rebuild this land. Shall I call on you to guide me well, To see our hopes and dreams fulfilled? On this day of our ascension.
VNV Nation - Honour
[Edit: the scrolling was really getting annoying and the url tag refused to work properly.]
[This message has been edited by Biggles (edited 07-25-2002).]
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[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
T.I.P.S.
Need I say more?
Bush can go frell himself.
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"Isn't the universe a wonderful place? I wouldn't want to live anywhere else! Love to stay! Can't! Have to go. Kiss kiss, love love! Bye!" - G'Kar
-BENJAMIN FRANKLIN
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AnlaShok, Captain of the Gray Hand of Fate Squadron
Sidhe-1
Wielder of the Big Heavy Hammer of Obvious Truth
"FABRICATI DIEM, PVNC!"
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[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
[b]"Those who are willing to trade freedom for security deserve neither freedom nor security."
-BENJAMIN FRANKLIN
[/b][/quote]
DAMN STRAIGHT!
- PJH
To bush supporters: why is Bush all that great ?
To Bush critics: is he REALLY that bad ?
We are living in a world where it is legal for the US to commit war crimes...
Messaih,
It was an agreement to exempt U.S peacekeepers from procecution under the International Criminal Court or ICC.
My problem with the ICC and other international organizations is the fact that we don't live in a world where every country respects human rights. To be legitimate, a global authority needs to represent the best of humanity, it can't be tainted by dictatorships and oppresive regimes. Because of those elements the court could be used solely for political purposes, by governments and groups pushing their own agenda. Thats why Bush and most every other politician opposes puting U.S troops under the jurisdiction of the ICC, not because the U.S military has no code of ethics.
Regardles of your opinion about the moral standards of the U.S military, the fact is that there are clear rules of engagement and codes of conduct that if broken may subject a soldier to court martial, dishonorable discharge, and time in a military prison. Furthermore if a sodier is given the order by his commander to say fire on a crowd of non-hostile unarmed civilians that order is deamed illegal, and it is the duty of the soldier to disobey it. The uniform code of military justice exists precisely to punish those sodiers who violate the srict moral, and honor codes that the military adhears to.
That being said, I think that the military should not be used to combat terrorism in the U.S. The military is trained to hunt, and kill another military force, its not meant to police or search for individual terrorist. That is the job of the FBI and state, and local police forces.
As for the Bush issue, I think alot of the measures put in place by his administration are crossing into uneasy territory, and do resemble some of the things we saw on B5.
But we also have to remember that it isn't just Bush who's pushing for measures such as citizencorps, its the whole political leadership. All these people want is votes and public support, so in the heat and fear after 911 they rushed in measures that served to give a false sense of security.
Take for example the office of homeland security, its just one big reorganization of even bigger beuracracies, yet we are sold on the illusion that it will stop terrorism.
I don't think there are seriously sinister forces like Clark in play right now, but if we continue down this slippery slope of giving up freedoms and giving more power to the government, then in the future someone like Clark will have all he needs to create a dictatorship.
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We Live as one, We die as one, We will face the darkness as one.
"Understanding is a Three Edged Sword- Your side, Their side, And the Truth...."
Regarding Vertigo1's comments about TIPS, since no one replied in the other thread I'll post it agian here:
Rather than have police reports going to the local precincts and then dying in a pile, don't you think it would be better if they went to a central source where they could at least do something!
A fertilizer delivery truck driver is a worthy source for identifying odd behavior because he has a routine pattern and knows whom usually gets fertilizer and when. He also has a hazardous chemical DCL and has had a background check done.
Here is how I see it. If the fertilizer delivery truck driver were to report strange deliveries to a non-agricultural address to the police it would most likely die in red tape.
If the fertilizer truck driver, were to fill out a report that a strange group was buying large amounts of fertilizer and send it to the central agency the report would go into a central computer with some kind of "red flag" algorithm. (Guess what folks the Fed. has been doing that kind of thing for years for phone and e-mail messages.) That report combines with another report from a prima-chord distributor because the deliveries are to different addresses but the same cell phone number, that sets off the red flag! The FBI or who ever swing into action to investigate further. A potential foreign or domestic terrorist act has been averted.
I don't see a problem there, and it works better than just reporting to the police, who have to much to worry about already: murders, rape, robbery, etc. If similar reports are ALREADY being made why not put them to productive use!
[b]Messaih,
It was an agreement to exempt U.S peacekeepers from procecution under the International Criminal Court or ICC.
[/b][/quote]
Yes?
And if you want my opinion on a better solution -> More funding for the police.
Edit: I think I see what you are trying to say. Do you think the ICC would have agreed had mr bush not threatened to remove his troops from the balkans?
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Passive fields. January two thousand and twelve. A nation that stands alone. Cold voices, faces pale, Gathered unto their judgement day. Such words remain unspoken. Such pride remains unbroken. Just mothers to stand in vain and cry. Tears and medals in the rain. Shall I recall when justice did prevail? No reason to be found why reason did fail. The all clear resounding. The way was clear to rebuild this land. Shall I call on you to guide me well, To see our hopes and dreams fulfilled? On this day of our ascension.
VNV Nation - Honour
[This message has been edited by Messiah (edited 07-24-2002).]
One day the human race will move towards a global government with a judicial branch being part of it, but this should only occur when all of earth's people are ready to accept human rights and democracy as essentials, and when a formal constitution is formed which sets up a fair and balanced system.
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We Live as one, We die as one, We will face the darkness as one.
"Understanding is a Three Edged Sword- Your side, Their side, And the Truth...."
and it wasn't just the Balkans that the US was threatening to withdrawl from... it was every UN peacekeeping mission...
[This message has been edited by Canuck (edited 07-25-2002).]
TheEXone: You say the court is made up of coutries that have different ways of ruling their people (in your words opressive and undemocratic). Shouldnt we take joy in that the court is democratic then at least?
I like this discussion (I like to discuss), but I am going home now, and will prolly not be able to use the net for a while. See you when I do [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img]
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Passive fields. January two thousand and twelve. A nation that stands alone. Cold voices, faces pale, Gathered unto their judgement day. Such words remain unspoken. Such pride remains unbroken. Just mothers to stand in vain and cry. Tears and medals in the rain. Shall I recall when justice did prevail? No reason to be found why reason did fail. The all clear resounding. The way was clear to rebuild this land. Shall I call on you to guide me well, To see our hopes and dreams fulfilled? On this day of our ascension.
VNV Nation - Honour