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The current forum climate

BigglesBiggles <font color=#AAFFAA>The Man Without a Face</font>
As many of you have noticed, this forum seems to be becoming a little agitated recently. An abundance of political discussions, where people's views clash, has contributed to this at least in part. Some people have complaining and saying they are going to leave because they don't like political discussions. Others are saying they will leave if they can't have them. In my opinion, the first lot are being silly. How many years have we been here now? And how many at the Sierra boards before that for many of us? Firstones.com has always been a community of tolerance and acceptance. If you feel you have to leave because some others are discussing things that bore you, you are making the wrong decision. Simply ignore those threads.

After much discussion, we have come up with a possible solution [to the political debates problem]. If you don't like political discussions, don't read them. Don't click on the thread title. There may be more of them now than there used to be, but I still only count approximately 6 threads with political or similar discussions on the entire page of the Zocalo. At Firstones.com, we pride ourselves on being a community of intelligent people who, unlike a lot of the world, are capable of listening too and accepting other people's points of view. There are plenty of threads available to discuss non-political things, and even whole other forums here. Be glad that you arn't an admin. We have to read (or at least check on) every thread to make sure that they arn't getting out of hand.
Also, try to remember that Firstones.com is an international community. Different people have different standards, different views. Try to respect them and don't post stuff that you know will offend others on purpose. As admins, we have to think of the forum as a whole. If things get bad in some way, we will close topics.
So remember, you don't have to read a thread. The choice is yours.

Don't leave because you don't like one thread.

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[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
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Comments

  • Alec MAlec M Award Winning Poster
    Amen.

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    [url="http://www.alecm.com/"]Alec McClymont[/url]
    "Something is only impossible until it's not."
  • StrikerStriker Provided with distinction
    Right on brother! =)

    MAKE LOVE NOT WAR!! lol

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    Chase
    Web Hosting Provider for FirstOnes.com
    http://www.radiusco.com/
  • Random ChaosRandom Chaos Actually Carefully-selected Order in disguise
    [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img] - nice post [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img]
  • JackNJackN <font color=#99FF99>Lightwave Alien</font>
    Works for me... [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img]
  • shadow boxershadow boxer The Finger Painter & Master Ranter
    the alternative is this folks...

    I chisel admin rights out of the 'gods' and then I build a new forum category...

    Za'hadum...

    the place which no thread leaves alive... bad threads, those which offend, have the potential to get truly ugly, nasty or just plain anit-social will get sucked into the realm of the Shadows, where conflict and strife are encouraged.

    A realm of negativity for those who really must persue every last detail of a thread to the point where it dissapears up it's own proverbial arse...

    In short, you can get bitchy and evil in your own corner of the room where no-one else has to put up with it. As I said to those in IRC...

    There is such a thing as 'freedom of speech' and there should also be very much a 'freedom of listening'.
  • Random ChaosRandom Chaos Actually Carefully-selected Order in disguise
    Oh, thanks for the dose of realism SB

    *smacks SB for the fun of it*

    Now welcome to Firstones
  • *Joins RC in Fwapping SB*

    seriously, Za'Ha'Dum might not be a bad idea...put it in place of one of the forums that no longer needed. (Like ideas for saving the game)

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    [b]whitestar90: [/b]"it would give the computer a heartattack just looking at it" -
    [b]Sanfam: [/b]"And Drazi didn't like it one bit.-
    [b]Mr.Bungle: [/b][i]"So that's where the forum went..."[/i]-
    ---
    [b][i]ahhh, the good old days of HTML.[/i][/b]
  • BigglesBiggles <font color=#AAFFAA>The Man Without a Face</font>
    I am completely against providing a place at firstones for people to yell and swear at each other. That is not wha this site is about.

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    [url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
    "Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
  • ArgoneArgone Genuine Klingon
    I'am Impressed Biggles, your smarter than your tank looks! [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/biggrin.gif[/img]

    Very Good Answer!

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    [b]4 Thousand Throats can be cut in one night by a running Warrior[/b]
  • [quote]Originally posted by Biggles:
    [b]I am completely against providing a place at firstones for people to yell and swear at each other. That is not wha this site is about.

    [/b][/quote]

    well, when you put it THAT way....

    I was thinking a place for topics like Moderate Muslim, the school topic, etc. once that are peacfully argued already, and just plop 'em in another forum so other members that don't want to see it, don't. [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img]



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    [b]whitestar90: [/b]"it would give the computer a heartattack just looking at it" -
    [b]Sanfam: [/b]"And Drazi didn't like it one bit.-
    [b]Mr.Bungle: [/b][i]"So that's where the forum went..."[/i]-
    ---
    [b][i]ahhh, the good old days of HTML.[/i][/b]
  • BigglesBiggles <font color=#AAFFAA>The Man Without a Face</font>
    Topics like that have every right to be in the Zocalo.

    Argone: Thanks. [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img]

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    [url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
    "Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
  • BekennBekenn Sinclair's Duck
    How about a separate forum for political/religious debate? Given that those are the ones that chiefly tend to incite such emotion, lumping them into a separate category might serve to keep the Zocalo nice and rosey.

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    We are here to place President Grenewetzki under arrest!
  • BigglesBiggles <font color=#AAFFAA>The Man Without a Face</font>
    The thing is, we don't actually have that many. A forum for them would be quite empty. Also, I'd like to avoid fragmenting the forums even more if possible.

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    [url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
    "Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
  • SanfamSanfam I like clocks.
    Now...how about...a forum for people who post between the hours of midnight and 12:01 AM?


    I think it's a neat idea...


    [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img] [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/vsml.gif[/img]
  • samuelksamuelk The Unstoppable Mr. 'K'
    I don't think making yet another forum is the answer. There's already one off-topic forum, and one is enough.

    This is, first and foremost, a Babylon 5 site. If a discussion can't fit in a B5 forum or an off-topic forum, then it really doens't belong here at all.
  • BigglesBiggles <font color=#AAFFAA>The Man Without a Face</font>
    [quote]Originally posted by Sanfam:
    [b]Now...how about...a forum for people who post between the hours of midnight and 12:01 AM?


    I think it's a neat idea...


    [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img] [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/vsml.gif[/img] [/b][/quote]

    And we can also have a forum for people who double post, and one for people who triple post, and so on! [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img]

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    [url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
    "Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
  • Random ChaosRandom Chaos Actually Carefully-selected Order in disguise
    [quote]Originally posted by Biggles:
    [b] And we can also have a forum for people who double post, and one for people who triple post, and so on! [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img]

    [/b][/quote]


    We already have the Warleader forum!
  • RandyRandy Master Storyteller
    I'm with Biggles 100%. Nice post, Biggles.
  • Well said Biggles - if you don't like a particular item, then don't go out of your way to expose yourself to it...

    I would suggest that political debates, and others from the social realm, but kept open within the context of the Zocalo - the fact is, conflicts of opinions aside, that they're actively engaging people; that people keep coming back to them is clear to see, and this forum, being open for discussion, should attempt to give people just that...
  • bobobobo (A monkey)
    I would rather there be more words flying, and less bullets.

    We apparently have a fairly diverse cultural membership. Ideas are bound to conflict, but this is EXACTLY the kind of place where these ideas should be explored: in a forum where we all know we have at least somethings in common (B5) and know the concepts presented on that show, whether we agree with al of them or not. Building on this commanality can only be a good thing.

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    bobo
    <*>
    B5:ITF
  • MessiahMessiah Failed Experiment
    [url="http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/Forum16/HTML/002170.html"]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/Forum16/HTML/002170.html[/url]

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    Talk is silver, but violence is gold.
  • shadow boxershadow boxer The Finger Painter & Master Ranter
    "Worship the beast, lest the beast you become."

    Toxic threads on a BBS are a part of life.

    As I said to Biggles ar length, closing threads is akin to putting duct tape over the mouths of those in the debate. That's a breech of the much touted and much abused Bill of Rights.

    Setting up a small but obviously volatile little corner of the BBS for the polluted, corrupted or twisted threads gives people the choice to listen or not to listen.

    When someone goes to Zahadum, the "abandon all hope, yea who enter here" signage, goes without saying.

    The very act of shifting a thread to Zahadum places a large and rather onerous scrutiny on those who go there. You are willingly entering a 'small hell'. Just by frequenting Zahadum you have to question why you are there in the Shadows realm.

    Evil and malice exist, in each and every one of us. Denying that is suicide.

    Dealing with it takes courage, this is coming from a guy who inner demons make Diablo look like a newborn kitten....

    I can almost guarantee that the moment a thread is sent to Zahadum... it will quietly shrivel and die away the death it very much deserves by even being there.
    I also think we'd see less than three threads go there every year, assuming the general populace of FO continues much as it has in the past.

    We need a scum filter on our BBS. We need a grim reaper to slice off that which rots, so the board can continue to grow straight and tall.

    If that duty falls to me, cool. No-ones likely to try and cross me or debate my judgement of when a thread 'has' to die....

    There's plenty of soot on my wings, I'm built for the job. As much as you lot of Bon Vivants want to carry on as is... the darkness lingers...

    and it hungers for Ostritch pie...
  • samuelksamuelk The Unstoppable Mr. 'K'
    [quote]"Worship the beast, lest the beast you become."
    Toxic threads on a BBS are a part of life.[/quote]

    No, death is a part of life. "Toxic threads" are a choice, and one which doesn't have to be tolerated here.

    [quote]As I said to Biggles ar length, closing threads is akin to putting duct tape over the mouths of those in the debate. That's a breech of the much touted and much abused Bill of Rights.[/quote]

    And is yelling "Fire!" in a crowded room also a breach of the Bill of Rights? Can I stand outside your home and shout profanities at will?

    This place costs money to run, and flamewars are an abuse of the rules to which you agree when you join the forums. This isn't like walking onto the street and screaming your lungs out. There are people who run this place, and just as you can throw someone out of your house, they can put an end to conversations that get out of hand here.

    [quote]Setting up a small but obviously volatile little corner of the BBS for the polluted, corrupted or twisted threads gives people the choice to listen or not to listen.[/quote]

    So you're basically creating a "slum". I don't agree that that's necessary.

    [quote]The very act of shifting a thread to Zahadum places a large and rather onerous scrutiny on those who go there. You are willingly entering a 'small hell'. Just by frequenting Zahadum you have to question why you are there in the Shadows realm.[/quote]

    And that puts a tarnish on this site. This isn't a road-side pool hall.

    [quote]Evil and malice exist, in each and every one of us. Denying that is suicide.[/quote]

    No one is denying anything. What we're saying is that if you can't act peaceful in the forums, you lack self-control and discipline.

    [quote]Dealing with it takes courage, this is coming from a guy who inner demons make Diablo look like a newborn kitten....[/quote]

    You're talking as if flamewars and trash talk are a necessity. I'd have to disagree with that. If you can't control your temper, you've got other problems.

    [quote]I can almost guarantee that the moment a thread is sent to Zahadum... it will quietly shrivel and die away the death it very much deserves by even being there.[quote]

    Then why even have that section of the forum in the first place? It will also die when it's deleted.

    [quote]I also think we'd see less than three threads go there every year, assuming the general populace of FO continues much as it has in the past.[/quote]

    Again, why would you create a brand new forum for only three threads per year?

    [quote]We need a scum filter on our BBS. We need a grim reaper to slice off that which rots, so the board can continue to grow straight and tall.[/quote]

    We have one. It's called moderators. First you say that this kind of stuff is inevitable and should stay, then you say that we need to get rid of it.

    The idea is to take out the trash, not leave it to stink up one corner of the room.

    [quote]There's plenty of soot on my wings, I'm built for the job. As much as you lot of Bon Vivants want to carry on as is... the darkness lingers...[/quote]

    I'd be just find to let the darkness linger in another place. This forum is an outlet for (primarily) Babylon 5 discussions. There's no [i]need[/i] for a flame-war forum.

    You yourself have said that it's just not necessary (only 3 posts per year, threads will die after going there, etc.)

    [This message has been edited by samuelk (edited 12-08-2002).]
  • RhettRhett (Not even a monkey)
    As the prophet Rodney King once said, "Can't we all just get along?" [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/biggrin.gif[/img] So you can just ignore the political threads if you dont like them. Sounds good to me.
  • shadow boxershadow boxer The Finger Painter & Master Ranter
    you Sam... are a fool
  • samuelksamuelk The Unstoppable Mr. 'K'
    There's no need for name-calling. We're all adults here. And slinging insults is the very thing that we don't need here.


    But basically, what you've said, is that you want a forum created for 3 posts per year; posts which will quickly die once moved to that forum.

    [This message has been edited by samuelk (edited 12-08-2002).]
  • Random ChaosRandom Chaos Actually Carefully-selected Order in disguise
    I agree with SamuelK. There is no need for name calling SB.
  • croxiscroxis I am the walrus
    Name calling. Sheesh.

    After i thought about it. We don't need a Z'ha'dum. B5tv.com has an NR-17 forums, and I would not mind something like that. Put we are too small to break up into more forums.
  • whitestar90whitestar90 Elite Ranger
    Very good pointers Biggles [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img]

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    "When it is time,come to this place,call our name,we will be here"-Walkers of Sigma957

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  • BigglesBiggles <font color=#AAFFAA>The Man Without a Face</font>
    Thank you, Sam, for making all the points I tried and failed to make on ICQ so clearly here.
    SB: Tone it down a bit. Just because someone disagrees with your idea, there is no need to call them a fool so bluntly.

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    [url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
    "Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
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