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Interesting archaeological find (no -- really. Read this.)
Bekenn
Sinclair's Duck
in Zocalo v2.0
[url="http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A60769-2002Oct21.html"]http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A60769-2002Oct21.html[/url]
Thoughts?
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We are here to place President Grenewetzki under arrest!
Thoughts?
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We are here to place President Grenewetzki under arrest!
Comments
As for my religious beliefs that should be a whole new topic. [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/rolleyes.gif[/img]
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[b]4 Thousand Throats can be cut in one night by a running Warrior[/b]
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[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
One of the bad things is its now known that the Palestinian authority is digging into temple mount and deliberatly destroying any and all old jewish artificats found there. I think the future will record that as great of a loss.
[b]Mary: "Why can't you be more like your brother?"[/b][/quote]
That wouldn't be Mary though... [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img]
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[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
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[b]4 Thousand Throats can be cut in one night by a running Warrior[/b]
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Talk is silver, but violence is gold.
Where's the picture?
[edit]Don't worry, found it. [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img][/edit]
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[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
[This message has been edited by Biggles (edited 10-23-2002).]
On a par with the rather distasteful attempts by the Israeli authorities to hamper any attempt to foster a strong Palestinian identity - hence the general use of 'Arabs' as the descriptive term in most official Israeli documents on the situation.
Like I said in the North Korea thread, go find some of the work by John Pilger - there's been a very deliberate effort at national embarassment and domination.
The thing Im trying to argue, along with Beken is that the there are many Israelis view this entirely as a war of genocide in the long run.
And I know about Israel's terrorist activities, I also know about the arab terrorist activities and such against the Ottomans prior to 1917.
The reason alot of people end up being pro Israeli is because alot of people, me included are convinced that the end game of the PLO is going to be genocide of the jewish population. Alot of people consider that to be a bad thing.
This problem could have been solved if Europe had decided to make a European jewish homeland, but nobody wanted to do that either. And considering the history of anti sematism in Europe, they had to have a homeland somewhere so we the world stuck them with people who couldnt effectivly fight it.
Now how the hell do we deal with this problem?
Israel is commonly seen as the pariah state; the new South Africa - especially within Europe - with an essentially racist policy of Palestinian suppression. That's not an extreme view, that's just a conclusion based upon what we see happening within the region; it's not anti-semitic, it's just the view of people becoming increasinly disgusted with a nation that's rapidly developing an incredibly poor human rights record.
I'll relate you back to the thread concerning North Korea for my regards on the 'siege mentality' - I strongly doubt that the end aim of the PLO is the genocide of the Jewish race; their aims are more territorial and nationalistic, as even their name suggests.
I wouldn't pin the blame for the state the Israeli nation now finds itself in solely upon Europe - the founders have a lot to be held accountable for, and their actions during the founding have gone a long way to fostering the current ambivalence the neihghbouring Arab states have for Israel - and who could blame them?
Put simply, in the context of near post-WWII Europe there was no room for an Israeli nation; where would it have gone in such a war ravaged land?
The solution was to put it where the Jewish culture was rapidly forming a core - and the UN came to an agreement on that; I wholeheartedly agree with the tenets of national self-determination, and no one could ever argue that the nation of Israeli was not a deserving cause for territory at that time.
However, that in no way excuses the terrorism running up to the foundation, nor the actions of Israel since - ethnic cleansing, institutionalised racism... and you've got to be kidding me if being Palestinian isn't to have an ethnic identity; if it wasn't before, it certainly is now, the years of Israeli occupation have forged it as something incredibly distinctive - and I find it incredibly naive to see Arab culture so homogeneous - and how should that make any difference?
Simple answer - it doesn't.
You deal with the problem the only way you can - you end the illegal occupation, you give the Palestinians what they have every right to; a homeland. The UN gave the Jewish people theirs, and Israeli bluntly ignored the UN when it condemned them for taking land from another; when it condemned their brutal actions, then and since.
Israel is a nation formed on the greatest of tragedies; and, saddeningly so, didn't appear to learn from the mistakes of the past.
I used to be pro-Israeli, until I questioned why people were willing to get on buses and blow themselves up. The apple has a worm.
I'm not anti-semitic; I know that's the usual retort, and I've had it aimed at myself on more than one occaision - I've always had zero-tolerance for racists, and always will - I'm a socialist, you know how it works [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img]